ROGER/- Hi Guys, nice to see you again. I have now worked with both of you on three projects, all within the space of a year, our first,' Dusters,' a unique Western set in America, written and directed by Noel, but with you Abel as efficient First Asst Director.
Noel/- Yes, Dusters was the first time we three collaborated.
Abel/- And I’m bloody pleased we did.
ROGER/- Me too because I scored a second film with you both. 'Jane,' with you Directing again, Noel, and Abel being that brutal Asst Director.
ABEL/- I’m not that Brutal, surely?
NOEL/- You’re a great backstop, Abel. I'm always pleased to have you there.
ROGER/- You indeed work well together. 'Jane’ was your second film, wasn’t it, Noel?
NOEL/- No, my third as writer/director but the second with Abel as my right-hand man, 1st AD. He was also Executive Producer along with our third colleague, Gordon Fletcher.
ROGER/- Gordon? The sound technician?
ABEL/- The same.
ROGER/- Oh, that's great; Gordie is a stickler for the best he can get. I’m so pleased he’s teamed up. He did excellent work on Dusters and Jane. And equally so with the one you Directed, Abel, 'Limbo.' Beautiful work, by the way, but we'll discuss that later. And we’ll also talk about your hands-on, Executive Producing Noel. What a versatile couple of guys you two are turning out to be.
NOEL/- Well, I guess to live the proverbial dream, you first need to create it and then successively drive yourself crazy from it!
ROGER/- Hardly crazy. Not for your audience, at least. As already, your combined work is getting great reviews and kudos, but… I think we’d better start at the beginning.
NOEL/- Once upon a time.
ABEL/- There were these two guys.
ROGER/- Hey, I’m writing this one.
NOEL/- Okay, okay, but before you start, let me crack the Jack. Do you want ice?
I did, so did Abel.
Roger/- Right, let’s get into it. You’re both young, extremely talented writers, directors, and producers. And although we've only known each other a short time, we have forged a strong bond and willingness to continue working together. However, both of your roots are in far distant shores; how come you came here, and what has driven you to make a mark artistically.
NOEL/- For me, settling down in Australia was not something I planned. I'm usually the guy who lands wherever the wind blows. As such, I was a rapper (dare I say MC) in a previous life. And pursuing that brought me to China, where I lived for the better part of 3 years.
ROGER/- Now wait a minute, you were a Rapper, and now you're a filmmaker?.
NOEL/- It's a long story, but by the time we finish this Jack Daniels, you'll know it. I was living in China when I met Ray. He’s South African, but Sydney was his home. We got on well, and with my Chinese contract expiring, I had a choice of returning home to Southern California or trying my hand at a relationship in Australia with Ray. And knowing one tends to regret the risks they don't take, I chose to take the risk and change countries for a second time.
To the reader.
At this stage, after Abel gave me his ancestral background and reasons for being here, I realized this interview was becoming far too interesting to collaborate both lives in one interview. So even though we continued to chat, I decided to make separate articles. This one will concentrate on Noel, and another shall cover Abel.
ROGER/- You're American of Filipino heritage, correct?
NOEL/- That's right. My mother is Filipino, and my father hails from Dutch ancestry by way of Kentucky. But given that combination and being from California, people just assume I'm Mexican. Órale ese!
ROGER/- A filmmaker who used to be a Rapper, in China no less.
NOEL/- Well, as I said, chasing a career in Hip-Hop brought me to China in 2011, but it would be remiss if I didn't mention that it was always my intention to be a filmmaker. Ever since I was a kid, I was attracted to two main things: music and movies. Anything else took a back seat. With film, there was something enjoyable that came from it, which couldn't (and still can't) be quantified for me. Then I saw A Nightmare on Elm Street. And it fucked me up. I didn't think I would make it through my teenage years should Freddy Krueger see fit to invade my nightmares, which he did on a nightly basis. Because of this, I decided to lean into my fear, and behind my parent's sleeping backs, I began to watch every horror movie I could get my hands on. In facing my fears, I began to love everything I was subjecting myself to. It was empowering, and I became fluent in stereotypical yet iconic horror tropes, which is why I've chosen to direct my output toward the horror genre. The game-changer for me was when I was about eleven years old. I watched a pay-per-view showing of "One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest, " and it caused me to become obsessed with Jack Nicholson, which brought me to "The Shining" and then to "Chinatown." And I started to imitate Nicholson as I wanted to be an actor.
A few years later, I saw Jack Lemmon in a film called "Days of Wine and Roses," which solidified my calling—and you guessed it, I started imitating Lemmon to sharpen my craft. Then two things happened: marijuana and hip-hop. I veered from my intended course and ended up having one helluva ride under that umbrella. But because I had chased a tangible music wave for so long, I lost track of those film sights. And it just so happened as things do that with the clean slate Australia afforded me, I could finally transcend from music into film, a transition that has become more and more tangible over the past six years. And, older now, I know it is not an actor I need to be. It's a storyteller! IE, stay behind the camera, Noel!
ROGER/ - So, after settling in Australia and choosing to become a filmmaker, how on earth did you meet Abel, and what caused the decision to become a co-writing team and production house?
NOEL/- I met Abel through a mutual friend who brought him onboard "Dusters" as a Grip Assist. But what struck me first about Abel, he was prepared for anything and, at a moment's notice, jumped into the Ute and headed out to Silverton, where we shot a portion of 'Dusters.' He needed no cajoling or prodding; he was THERE!. What's more, I promoted him from Grip Assist to 1st AD after the first two shots. And I dare to bet, that's a first in the industry! And in the minutiae of making films, we discovered we had the same interests, i.e., horror! I also respected his views as a filmmaker in his own right. Not that I'm the be-all to end-all, but you need to impress if you want me to take you seriously as a creative. But above all else, I found kindred energy. I can't tell you how many people I've come across in my misadventures that are all talk, even at the bottom of the barrel. People who claim they will make things happen then disappear or find excuses when the time comes. I tend to think it's an ailment of a younger generation who either over-commit or want instant shots of dopamine. And I used to be that guy, so to find someone Abel's age who is as tunnel-visioned as I am toward making like-minded content is a godsend. He's someone I can be professionally responsible for, and if I can be a bit cocky, I think we know what we're doing, even though we feel like we have no fucking clue!
ROGER /- Believe me, you're both doing fine. But what on earth is the name under which you have decided to write your collaborative work?
NOEL/- I happened to be in Paris in 2019 and met a horror film writer from Bulgaria named Axmo Deus. We had a great conversation about genre film, and he told me he had a stack of scripts he’d like me to read. Consequently, I received some exciting stuff. But interestingly, all were around one minute in length and had come with Axmo’s blessing to make if I felt so inclined. I showed them to Abel, and he, like I, thought we had found the content we needed to maintain the development of our longer-form Shorts and Features. So that's how our Axmo Deus brand came to be.
ROGER/- What films have you already made?
NOEL/- The first one ever (outside of music video clips I released as VITAL Emcee) was called "I'm Sorry Mommy" (2017). I wrote and produced while Sonja Lowe, a talented friend of mine, directed. We won the Audience Choice Award for Best Australian Short at the A Night of Horror International Film Festival in 2017. Sonya also produces a successful true-crime podcast, The Evidence Locker, which I host. Anywho, following 'I'm Sorry Mommy", I made "The Malicious," which I wrote, produced, and directed. Amongst a few other awards, it won Best Female Performance and Audience Choice – Best Australian Short -- at this year's A Night of Horror, which makes me back-to-back winners with them. I'm over the moon about that, so shoutout to A Night of Horror for giving me a bit of street cred! Following that was "Dusters" in 2019, which I still plan to put out to the circuit, COVID-willing, and then "Jane" just a few months back. Abel and I also began releasing our Axmo Deus shorts on social media in October of 2020.
ROGER/- Quite a workload for someone who considers himself a newbie. Do you have any co-productions or co-written work that you intend to put out?
NOEL/- Well, I believe that any future projects we have on the slate will all be co-productions, including our third EP, Gordon. There's the Axmo stuff that comes out at the top of each month, as well as two more longer-form Shorts that I've written and will direct. There are a few features we have been developing as well, including a Feature version of "The Malicious."
ROGER/- Did I hear you're creating or have already completed a script for a feature-length 'Dusters'? If so, how far advanced are you on that?
NOEL/- Yes, "Dusters" has reached the final draft of its feature adaptation, and I can guarantee it's insane in the best way. I believe that it's everything you'd never expect in a Western, like a Nolan-type narrative covered in Tarantino wrapping. Abel and I have put together a template budget and shooting schedule, but it needs more work as far as pitch materials go. I intend to create a speed reel for it to sell the Proof of Concept and bridge it to the Feature. "Dusters" is something that needs to be respected in a budgetary sense, and I may need to prove myself further as a Director with something lower-budget before I tackle it. But like I said earlier, all of our future slate will be co-production. That's why we are currently adapting "The Malicious." I have also finished a treatment for another feature that I'm quite excited about called "Aorta." If the Gods remain as crazy as I need them to, we'll see these through without the limiting checklists and agendas of bureaucrats who nowadays seem to be too embarrassed by genre film… their loss!
Roger/- It is interesting to see how you and Abel get stuck into the Post Production work despite what your official positions may have been on the shoot.
NOEL/- As EPs on everything we've been doing, we are involved with this kind of stuff from the onset of pre-production. Irrespective of who may be Directing or individually writing, we respect each other's creative souls. I like to think that I am in a continuous process of becoming a better filmmaker because of those I surround myself. I know the story I want to tell, but Abel helps me translate that vision through shots and edits. I won't pretend I know exactly how things need to be, but so long as we know our basic coverage, I can then consult other HODs on further creative choices. Film-work is teamwork, and dammit, I'm thankful for the team.
Roger/- You rely on music to dramatize your work; is this a conscious decision? I mean do you pontificate over every music sting, or is it a casual, “She'll be right, mate,” choice?
Noel/- I think every creative has to dance a fine line between being open to change while pleasing the inner control freak. YES! I pontificate, meditate, cry, laugh, and eventually, hopefully, praise each subtlety of sound and nuance. Mostly because I am making horror films that rely on sound. I also feel very honoured to be working with the Composer Matthew Hamm because we both have the same tastes, and he always knocks a queue or a theme out of the park! He also understands the vision of what we are trying to create and the long game that we are playing. I think that's why some of our output works so well; we have aces in every department who believe in the visions we are trying to achieve.
ROGER/- Now that you're up there on the circuit, winning awards, getting acclaim, it may not be long before you're in the big league and dealing with a cross-section of actors you may not have the luxury of handpicking. How do you feel about handling controversial or less co-operative actors? I know you experienced a little of this on 'Dusters'; you had TC De Witt and Rene Mitchell Aranda, both American actors playing leads and an American Cameraman. But from what I can gather, none of these gave you grief, but there was a moment on the first day of shooting where one of your actors, in an attempt to hide the fact he came ill-prepared, tried to take over Direction. I was pleased to see you jump in and put an end to it quickly.
NOEL/- Haha, yes, that will be one of those forever moments of personal validity. It was a circumstance where lines weren't learned and pages of the script placed where the actor could read while performing. And in an attempt to capture a performance, he tried to tell us how to grab the shots. But with that shoot, the goalposts changed with each take. However, with this being only my second Short, and that actor being talented with an impressive body of work, I let him dictate how he wanted to get it done. Unfortunately, about a third of the day in, I was so confused, and it made my insecurities flare because I could not understand how I, the film's writer and director, was just not keeping up. So, on one ill-fated take, I lost my place again and just blew my top and explained in as nice a manner as possible, that as had happened so many times on this day, we were doing something different from what I intended. And I'll never forget, that's when Abel stepped forward saying that he thought the same thing… and then other crew members came forward to back me. So, feeling validated and (thank God) sane, I was able to get a performance from the actor while still getting our shots… though we always had to realign the shooting schedule at the end of each day. But while I appreciate the performance he gave, I also understand the situation gave me the courage to speak up to someone who at first may have looked down upon me. Funnily enough, the next day, he told me how great he thought the script was and how thrilled he was with the Production Design. I appreciated it to no end, but it begged the question… didn't you read the script before?
ROGER/- You're a fit and active young man. Would you ever resort to using your physical skills to end any differences with outrageous or undisciplined actors?. (It is not unknown, but in my 50 odd years of film making, the necessity of putting down fellow actors and, in one case, an out-of-control director has only occurred maybe three times).
NOEL/- I have never been a hothead. So I don't think I would ever resort to physical skills. If I did, I'd first question how I got into the circumstance and if it was my fault. And while I can't say it will never happen, I would need to know my kindness was being treated as weakness and manipulated before these thoughts would occur. But I'm pragmatic and, above all else, would need to make sure our Production insurance and completion bonds were in line and set before raining any of my ungodly hellfire down!
ROGER/- Good to know I don't fancy being beleaguered by one of those huge Dutch fists if I happen to step out of line.
I note your propensity to capture every line, innuendo, and scene written on the page. It is a dream for most filmmakers, but I note yours is almost word for word and angle, for angle that you have on the page. Do you see the vision you want and write the script, or do you write a rough outline and, once visualized, transpose that?
NOEL/- I'm a bit of an open book on that because the material always dictates my mind's eye. Sometimes I'll know what I want from the jump, but other times, I see the narrative I'm pursuing and need to collaborate with the team to see how best it can be executed. My strength (I feel) pertains to the story and hopefully the majority of the dialogue, so I know more or less how I want my talent to deliver. But knowing this, I choose to let my actors interpret the scene the way they feel, and it either aligns with what I'm looking for or doesn't. The trouble is, it takes collaboration to get those stars aligned. But I don't aim to control the talent. Same with my DP. I'll make a shot list that nets us the necessary coverage, but because I believe the DP knows more about his craft than I do, I allow their creativity to "fuller the vision" if it aligns. All I want to do is tell my story in the manner I need it to be told.
ROGER/- Noel, there was a bit in 'Jane' where I expressed my lack of conviction during a scene. When I mentioned it, you replied, "Yes, I wanted to do that in one take. It didn't work, so I thought I'd fix it in post."
NOEL/- As simple as they appear on paper, things always end up being more complicated than you plan. In that particular scene, we follow the Jane character as she leaves the room, and while we’re doing that, our Art Department came in and dirtied you up, and still filming, we follow our Jane character back to where she sees the mess you’re in, all in one single movement. And on camera, everything seemed fine, but the issue that came up in post was the camera was not wholly locked off and had moved, creating a bad jump cut effect for what was supposed to be a locked-off camera! Thankfully, Abel and I were successful in making the transition between the two shots.
ROGER/- Sorry I mentioned it. Here am I worried about five seconds of my performance, and you’re arsing about trying to salvage a technical disaster of three minutes. Actors should stick to saying their lines. But I’m a pedantic old bastard when it comes to my work.
NOEL/- As a creative, I don’t think you can never afford not to be critical, Roger, so I get it. I’m sure there’s hidden footage somewhere of me in an edit, yelling maniacally at the computer screen upon discovering some new obstacle that wasn’t caught on any given day. But it’s this that makes us magicians…
ROGER/- On the much lengthier Dusters, you were shot after shot, close up, long, continuous, and had five leads, all needing equal cover. You impressed me, not only with your calm demeanor when I know you were seething inside but also with your determination to get what you wanted. I heard later there was a lot of clipping done in post. Did that give you a false sense of security in relying on the edit to get what you want, or are you still determined to get what you can in the camera on the day?
NOEL/- I think that there’s a bit of truth to both sides. It made me insecure for the edit, but because I faced more-or-less the same insecurities on “The Malicious,” it didn’t faze as much as it could have. If we had a budget that bought us more time, then I’m sure I’d get what I want in the way that I want it, but because we don’t, I think we always find ourselves in the ballpark of “we can make it work”. Sometimes we nail it, and other times we just have to make it work. At the end of the day, “Dusters” ended up in a strange place where it was either too long if we honoured the story or too short if we clipped. Because of that, I decided I wanted it to play like a 30-minute episode of “The Twilight Zone” and stay true to what was written on the page. And I still believe that is the best way to get its mystery across as a Proof of Concept with stakes attached. It may not be the most popular run time within the Film Festival circuit, and God knows I’ve been asked to cut it, but as a filmmaker who was on his second go, I knew it would be disadvantaged if I trimmed. So, until someone else comes along and shows me a 15-20-minute cut that I’m happy to take to my grave, I’m comfortable right where it is. And all this being said, the Feature script is going to blow you away!
ROGER/- So, there you have it, Noel’s career in a nutshell. I am sure you youngsters with your video phones and small cameras will delight in Noel’s anecdotes and experiences, and those that are already up there will resonate. In finalizing, do you have any words of wisdom or advice for the would-be’s out there, Noel?
NOEL/- The only thing I can say is: if you have a true desire to pursue something, anything, then it has to outweigh any and every fear. As a creative, we have to nurture a healthy amount of delusion to keep persisting after getting knocked down, but it’s the fear that is going to keep one from getting back up. So, it’s your choice. What is more decisive: your fear or your desire?
RW/- Thank you, Noel, I’m sure the readers out there with a film-making career will absorb your information, and those in other aspects of the industry will find your life and times extremely interesting. Now, have we got another bottle of Jack? This one appears to be empty.
Iconic actor and writer Roger Ward is a regular contributor to The Australian Short Film Network Journal.
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